From a resident - I call this stating the obvious
Comment - several things here should beno surprise - Ruland's continued involvement, the potential owner's stance on protecting HCC members and higher costs to residents. Been sayin' it all along. Here is the post in total
Insider information, This was forwarded to me by an HCC source
Submitted by Tiarussi on Fri, 10/02/2009 - 4:43pm.
Golf Course
Essentially we are screwed if these issues are not addressed regarding Shining Rock. I met with HCC board members off the record last night and this morning on the course.
As far as the Owner's Tournament it has been called off. At the time it was still on, I could only get my name on the list and no-one from shining rock, which starts me on now why is that?
Right now there are 2 real owners of HCC, Dan McGloughlin and Joe Pascwale (do not know correct spelling of either last name). Tim Gordon has been put in the game a 1% owner of HCC to be their GM and run things.
Tim is allowed to plan his course of action and run with it, such as he has done since this Shining Rock Deal was in play. Here is the new info where we are screwed if we do not rock the boat a little at this upcoming meeting at the town hall Oct. 13th.
HCC/Tim Gordon's plan is not to ever include Shining Rock residents as part of their business plan. Essentially they know they do not need us nor do they really want us.
If they get full approval of this 2100 Sq Ft. snack shack (not 3,000 which most of us thought) and tent from our town board members without intervention then we will be in a worse off position then we are now and here is why:1. Our investment at shining rock was based on the planning boards approval of a Full working clubhouse with locker rooms, restaurant, bar, with approximately 15,000 sq ft. with outdoor pool and tennis courts. Perks also included preferred tee times, etc.....2. With the new plan, my sources tell me that shining rock residents will not get ANY perks, the only perks from what they are telling me is that we can join HCC.3. HCC also plans on charging non-HCC members a large fee to even play the course in our own back yard. These fees will be in a range that most will not even pay, which is exactly what they want. The proposed rates to join their club or even play our course will be substantially higher then their members. Tim Gordon has made it clear that this is ONLY a satellite course to HCC so all their tournaments will shuttle their members in from their club to play this course then back to their clubhouse.4. Our investment will only go down not up when the course is functional. Who is going to buy a home on a course where they cannot afford a round of golf, and if you want to have the full amenities of a full working club you will have to join HCC by traveling 15 minutes away from your investment to use those services, not to mention the additional fees as well that most are not willing to pay. NOTE: HCC plans on at least charging every Shining Rock resident/future member $3500/year to play golf and that does not include cart, however, we would be allowed to play on their course 2 times a month, but NOT be allowed to use any of their amenities. How many are really willing to pay this for a snack shack at a course we want to play on, not theirs.5. HCC knows we have a much better course, and they are banking on their own members to float additional fees to be able to play two course.Tim Gordon has threatened to the board and residents that if the board imposes the club house or any of its amenities then they will back off the deal. First, Tim does not have the authority without Dan or Joe do back out of this deal, and never would since they only are spending 2.5 million for the entire course. Alone with irrigation and greens you are at a 1.5 million dollar tag, not to mention the 3 million the bank has dumped into this place. They would never walk away from a deal like this when they paid 7 million for the Saddle Hill course. Even if they do bow out the entire course could be bought by 250 people at 10,000 each which I already know at least 50 members at HCC would go in on for this kind of deal, and walk away from HCC.
Joe and Dan from what I have been told hear nothing from Tim Gordon unless he gets resistance. Without resistance Tim is allowed to stay his course, his own course most of the time from what I have been told. Most of the time when the members over at HCC speak out against Tim, Joe and Dan then stand in to meet most if not all the members requests. They are business men not idiots, why bite the hand that feeds you.
Up until now no one has given any resistance against Tim Gordon's requests nor has really anyone asked him what his "actual" plans are for all of us up here at Shining Rock. Why's that, because he doesn't care. He wants to get away with everything he can at as low of a cost to HCC as possible. Also, he has been connected with side-bar dealings with the former owner Fred Ruland, the one who left all of us with this mess. Has he been asked what his involvement with Fred is regarding this community?
If in the end if everyone panics and is convinced that giving into Tim Gordon's demands by getting the course operational is the way to go, then we will have a course in our back yard we've all waited 4-6 years for that most likely we will not want to join or cannot join do to the costs. If you are one of the more fortunate ones to afford the costs, then why pay them for an investment that now you have to travel 15 minutes to get at HCC to enjoy. Resale value was in the community IE: clubhouse, pool, tennis courts, etc….that the planning board had approved, which is why we all bought into this community in the first place.
The investment is here where our homes are not at HCC.
Need more of your inputs on this one. HELP !!!!!!!
Insider information, This was forwarded to me by an HCC source
Submitted by Tiarussi on Fri, 10/02/2009 - 4:43pm.
Golf Course
Essentially we are screwed if these issues are not addressed regarding Shining Rock. I met with HCC board members off the record last night and this morning on the course.
As far as the Owner's Tournament it has been called off. At the time it was still on, I could only get my name on the list and no-one from shining rock, which starts me on now why is that?
Right now there are 2 real owners of HCC, Dan McGloughlin and Joe Pascwale (do not know correct spelling of either last name). Tim Gordon has been put in the game a 1% owner of HCC to be their GM and run things.
Tim is allowed to plan his course of action and run with it, such as he has done since this Shining Rock Deal was in play. Here is the new info where we are screwed if we do not rock the boat a little at this upcoming meeting at the town hall Oct. 13th.
HCC/Tim Gordon's plan is not to ever include Shining Rock residents as part of their business plan. Essentially they know they do not need us nor do they really want us.
If they get full approval of this 2100 Sq Ft. snack shack (not 3,000 which most of us thought) and tent from our town board members without intervention then we will be in a worse off position then we are now and here is why:1. Our investment at shining rock was based on the planning boards approval of a Full working clubhouse with locker rooms, restaurant, bar, with approximately 15,000 sq ft. with outdoor pool and tennis courts. Perks also included preferred tee times, etc.....2. With the new plan, my sources tell me that shining rock residents will not get ANY perks, the only perks from what they are telling me is that we can join HCC.3. HCC also plans on charging non-HCC members a large fee to even play the course in our own back yard. These fees will be in a range that most will not even pay, which is exactly what they want. The proposed rates to join their club or even play our course will be substantially higher then their members. Tim Gordon has made it clear that this is ONLY a satellite course to HCC so all their tournaments will shuttle their members in from their club to play this course then back to their clubhouse.4. Our investment will only go down not up when the course is functional. Who is going to buy a home on a course where they cannot afford a round of golf, and if you want to have the full amenities of a full working club you will have to join HCC by traveling 15 minutes away from your investment to use those services, not to mention the additional fees as well that most are not willing to pay. NOTE: HCC plans on at least charging every Shining Rock resident/future member $3500/year to play golf and that does not include cart, however, we would be allowed to play on their course 2 times a month, but NOT be allowed to use any of their amenities. How many are really willing to pay this for a snack shack at a course we want to play on, not theirs.5. HCC knows we have a much better course, and they are banking on their own members to float additional fees to be able to play two course.Tim Gordon has threatened to the board and residents that if the board imposes the club house or any of its amenities then they will back off the deal. First, Tim does not have the authority without Dan or Joe do back out of this deal, and never would since they only are spending 2.5 million for the entire course. Alone with irrigation and greens you are at a 1.5 million dollar tag, not to mention the 3 million the bank has dumped into this place. They would never walk away from a deal like this when they paid 7 million for the Saddle Hill course. Even if they do bow out the entire course could be bought by 250 people at 10,000 each which I already know at least 50 members at HCC would go in on for this kind of deal, and walk away from HCC.
Joe and Dan from what I have been told hear nothing from Tim Gordon unless he gets resistance. Without resistance Tim is allowed to stay his course, his own course most of the time from what I have been told. Most of the time when the members over at HCC speak out against Tim, Joe and Dan then stand in to meet most if not all the members requests. They are business men not idiots, why bite the hand that feeds you.
Up until now no one has given any resistance against Tim Gordon's requests nor has really anyone asked him what his "actual" plans are for all of us up here at Shining Rock. Why's that, because he doesn't care. He wants to get away with everything he can at as low of a cost to HCC as possible. Also, he has been connected with side-bar dealings with the former owner Fred Ruland, the one who left all of us with this mess. Has he been asked what his involvement with Fred is regarding this community?
If in the end if everyone panics and is convinced that giving into Tim Gordon's demands by getting the course operational is the way to go, then we will have a course in our back yard we've all waited 4-6 years for that most likely we will not want to join or cannot join do to the costs. If you are one of the more fortunate ones to afford the costs, then why pay them for an investment that now you have to travel 15 minutes to get at HCC to enjoy. Resale value was in the community IE: clubhouse, pool, tennis courts, etc….that the planning board had approved, which is why we all bought into this community in the first place.
The investment is here where our homes are not at HCC.
Need more of your inputs on this one. HELP !!!!!!!
posted by SR Fan Club President @ 5:11 AM
1 Comments:
At 1:32 PM,
Anonymous said…
Can't believe all the false statements in this comment! First off, it's been 4 and 1/2 years we've been waiting for the course to open - not 6. The condo community is only 4 and 1/2 yrs old to the day!! The course is opening tomorrow (April 23, 2010), and anyone wishing to play may do so. The cost is very, very reasonable. You can go on their website and get the fees. I did not join, for family reasons, and I can play Monday thru Thursday for $40 with a cart (senior). However, if I weren't a senior, I would pay $55 - more than comperable to any place around here (and those courses are not a match for the beauty and shape of Shining Rock). As a Shining Rock resident I can play on the weekends after l:30 for $45. They have made it most affordable for resident, members and the public. I have played many courses around the area, and after talking to the personnel at the "temporary" clubhouse today, I have never felt more welcomed (particularly as a woman). They plan on having a Sat. or Sun. tourney just for the Shining Rock residents so everyone can get aquainted. Contrary to what the writer has stated, they are not trying to push us out, only have HCC people here, making it so expensive we can't afford it, etc, etc. The beautification of our neighborhood is progressing, thanks to the golf course, and it's exciting that we are now going to be able to socialize with our neighbors - and maybe meet new people that come our way.
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